Axiom2017

In March of 2015, I traveled to Cuba on a www.CubaExplorer.com People-to-People program. ...had a stellar time in all respects. A few in our group arrived a week prior and joined us for our adventures. Others stayed afterwards to travel independently. With djt's dictum which transpired last Friday the 16th some changes have been made in traveling to this island nation. Because I plan to return next year-- I rang the aforementioned company two days ago and was informed that one can still travel this way because you would be or have been with a sanctioned tour. That's the route I'll take. After or before the travel, I'll devise my own itinerary and travel independently.

Another comany I'd recommend is www.locallysourcedcubatours.com. ...used its services in 2017 but was only able to be in the independent mode for three days. I arrived in Habana, met my prepaid driver at the airport who in turn took me to my wonderful casa particular [Hostal Plaza Vieja 1910] which was on the edge of this plaza and within two minutes from the plaza itself. ...reasonably priced per night and included breakfast]. ...stayed here for three nights before I had to abort my trip because of a back flare up. ...decided not to join the group on Monday for 20 days going throughout the island. I chose this company because of the independent components involved and all of their offerings. I also chose it because of the cost. Both of these which I am recommending are under $3000. My tour by itself which included lodging and a few meals cost under $2000.

Check out both websites and decide. I do think that since djt has reversed former President Obama's policy, this would be the route to take unless you desire travel to Cuba via another country instead of from Florida.

I am rereading this forum relative to Cuban travel, my great guide books, websites of note, etc. in planning for 2018. djt is NOT going to impede my freedom with his antiquated, inhumane, bogus policy.

SambaChula

"After or before the travel, I'll devise my own itinerary and travel independently."

According to what's been published so far, that would not be allowed.



You mention cost, but not for what duration., so hard to ascertain value.

Jeff_Costa_Rica

Agreed that under the new rules, it looks like your entire time in Cuba will have to be spent with a group tour. A portion of the time won't be good enough. What you choose to do pre- or post-tour is your own choice, of course. The tour operator isn't going to take any responsibility for your decision

SusieQQ

I traveled with RoadScholar and it was great. They offer more than one itinerary, BTW. I highly recommend them. And although it has a reputation of being for older travelers, we had all ages in our group.

Axiom2017

SusieQQ, I checked into Insight Cuba, RoadScholar, and Grand Circle Foundation. Although their tours offer some wonderful itineraries, the cost of these are $4000 and above. ...would like to take in one or more from these companies, but currently the costs from a US based company are prohibited; the length of time is limited as well.

SambaChula, one's traveling with either of the two companies I recommended does not exceed above $3500 for a week or longer; the latter company offered a week to two weeks.

At any rate the American companies charge a lot for one to travel to Cuba. I've researched extensively for two years.

Jeff-Costa-Rica-- I rang CubaExplorer to see if I could still do what I cited and received an affirmative response. I am quite cognizant of the impending changes.

Axiom2017

locallysourcedcuba.com is the correct web address.

SambaChula

"...either of the two companies I recommended does not exceed above $3500 for a week or longer..."

Thanks Jeff. For some of us, that's very expensive.
A week cost much less than U$1000, including airfare from northeast US, comfortable lodging, meals at good paladars, souvenirs, sightseeing and entry fees to sights, domestic transportation between cities and within, and didn't feel like pinching pennies/centavos.

"I rang CubaExplorer to see if I could still do what I cited and received an affirmative response. "

Then I guess they know something that no one else knows yet, probably not even those who'll be writing the new "guidance".
If someone is covered by the tour agency's special license for the group, guaranteeing that you are participating in a full time program of approved activities, how would you be covered when not under their direct supervision for days, not just a few hours of free time during the tour? If you have to apply for your own OFAC license for the time after/before the tour, why bother with a tour at all?

Jeff_Costa_Rica

All indications are that the trip as you describe will no longer be legal. The tour operator is not going to accept any responsibility for what you do pre- or post-tour. They can't and won't guarantee anything to you. You are free to travel anywhere you like. You alone are responsible for your decision.

Lois2

personally I have zero interest in being "escorted" around Cuba. We went in Jan. on our own hiring guides as needed and booking our own choice of casas etc. So glad we went...wanted to return and spend even more time in Havana and go to Trinidad but will not pay $5,000 per person not including air knowing how much this stuff really costs and also don't need babysitting or moving around with 10-40 of my fellow countrymen. So won't return unless situation is same as before. Disgusting situation.

SambaChula

Well, "support for the Cuban people" seems the way to go if general licenses still exist for individuals (since P2P is out for individuals), but we don't yet know how/if that category will be defined in much more detail, or if travelers would be back to applying formally to OFAC for a special license.

SusieQQ

When I went with RoadScholar we were under the old licensing which seems will be reinstated. We had some last minute additions to our group from another tour company who failed to have their certification renewed.

And although we had a Guide from RoadScholar, we were assigned a Cuban Tour Guide and Bus Driver who met us at the airport and ran the whole thing.

sf7307

Our tour is costing nowhere near the prices Road Scholar and Backroads charge. We'll see how it goes.

Jeff_Costa_Rica

"Well, "support for the Cuban people" seems the way to go if general licenses still exist for individuals"

"Support for the Cuban people" was always quite a rigidly defined category under the old rules. It meant traveling there under the auspices of an international organization that works for democracy in Cuba. If the new rules essentially revert to the old rules, that's what the category will be. It is not going to Cuba and talking to people you meet on the street.

Lois2

Jeff...I guess you can continue to expound on what all this means but people should be clear that thousands and thousands of US traveler's have traveled since Obama softened the rules and Support for the Cuban people was used by most of us and we were not with an "international organization"...but the People to People is the one he is changing or says he will...until the rules come out this speculation is sort of pointless and frankly misleading for the potential new Cuba traveler. And staying at casas as some of the $3000+ per person tours referenced above clearly indicates how inflated those prices are. Casas are normally $30-$50 per night not per person and sightseeing tours are not expensive either...nothing really is and these tours charge excessive amounts because people are confused...but lets see what happens.

SambaChula

This is the wording for the "support for the Cuban people" OFAC category, below.
Note the words "Individuals .....that promote independent activity intended to strengthen civil society in Cuba"

Does it not promote independent activity and strengthen civil society to support with your money and bookings the cuentapropistas (private entrepreneurs) who run casas particulares and paladares and who drive private taxis and give private tours?

Since no one has been audited within recent memory for using this category to travel, it is hard to know exactly.......unless the new "guidelines" define this category in much more detail, and also what "full time" means in hours, but the actions mentioned above seem to fall within the official wording.
___________________________________

515.574 Support for the Cuban People.
(a)General license. The travel-related transactions set forth in § 515.560(c) and other transactions that are intended to provide support for the Cuban people are authorized, provided that:
(1) The activities are of:
(i) Recognized human rights organizations;
(ii) Independent organizations designed to promote a rapid, peaceful transition to democracy; or
(iii) Individuals and non-governmental organizations that promote independent activity intended to strengthen civil society in Cuba; and
(2) The traveler's schedule of activities does not include free time or recreation in excess of that consistent with a full-time schedule.

SambaChula

Also, from a poster on another forum:

"Senator Rubio himself tweeted advise to use an individual channel which is at least as hard to define and control as people to people educational travel:
"Individual Americans can travel to #Cuba under Support for the Cuban people category but must use privately owned lodging like AirBnB"

Jeff_Costa_Rica

Lois, you're missing my point. "Support for the Cuban people" was rigidly defined under the pre-Obama rules. Until 2015, it was never about going to Cuba on your own and talking to people you met on the street. If the new rules revert to the pre-Obama rules, it will be a difficult category for the average person to claim. That's all I said.

SambaChula

The wording quoted above from the official site IS the CURRENT definition.

Can you find some definition (with source cited) previous to that one to quote here so we know what you purport to?

And of course, no one yet knows what the future "guidelines" will bring. Since Rubio has advised using the "support" category, it seems unlikely that the definition will "revert".
As Lori said: "...until the rules come out this speculation is sort of pointless and frankly misleading for the potential new Cuba traveler."
Misleading is the concerning word. Most new Cuba travelers do not seem very well informed or well read about the rules, new or old. And most law abiding US travelers seem easily intimidated about any changes that may come that limit their right to travel to Cuba.
It is a shame to perpetuate ANY intimidating and limiting information here on this forum, as pure speculation, especially in the interim for trip planning under the Obama rules, until the actual guidelines are published.

Jeff_Costa_Rica

Again, missing my point. These are the current regs that were put into place under Obama's opening to Cuba two years ago. I think you see a disagreement here when none exists.

Jeff_Costa_Rica

In Post #2 in this thread, you advised the OP that s/he wouldn't be able to travel independently. Wasn't that also speculation? I personally don't think it is based on what I've read, but if your maintain that we shouldn't yet speculate, then yours was premature advice too.